Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Vicki Betts
I'm getting _Letters from Forest Place_ ready to send back on
interlibrary loan, and found this bit on shawls. The writer is living in Austin, corresponding with a sister in Mississippi.
Letitia Walton to Mary Watkins, Austin 24, 1861
I have seen a good many woolen shawls this year. Looked like they were crocheted, netted, or something of the kind. I think them very pretty, but did not feel ablt to buy one. I would prefer a shawl to a talma (talmas are out of fashion are they not?) and be much more obliged to you for one to wear next fall if you feel like doing that sort of work on vacation.
--_Letters from Forest Place: A Plantation Family's Correspondence, 1846-1881_. Edited by E. Grey Dimond and Herman Hattaway. Jackson: University Press of Mississippi, 1993, p. 223.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terri Shill
Vicki Betts wrote:
"Looked like they were
crocheted, netted, or something of the kind. "
Were these Orenberg shawls, do you think?
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Vicki Betts
I had to google that one. The webpages I saw said that was a Russian technique. Have you seen it in the United States in mid-19th century, maybe under another name?
I just did an advanced search on the 1860 Texas census, and was
shocked! shocked! to see 25 persons born in Russia, living in Texas in 1860. I really thought there would be zero. Nine were in Bexar County. None in Fayette, home of Henkel Square. But of course shawls could be imported. But the rest of the quote seems to indicate that her little sister back in Mississippi might make one for her, so whatever technique she is talking about she seems to think her sister would know. So I don't know. Knitting is not one of my "thangs."
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terre Schill
I will tell you the very little bit I know about Orenberg shawls, Vicki.
I first saw them listed on Anna Worden's shawl site. I don't have the web address anymore but a search should turn it up unless she has taken it down. Orenbergs are listed with about a dozen other shawl types she has documented to mid-19th century America. I did see one on a museum site once, off-white, I think Anna gave me the link to that. The period bragging on these shawls was that they could be passed through a wedding ring! So perhaps not many survived. I don't really know what they might have been called during the period. I believe they were all imported, strictly one-off, not a manufactured item.
eBay is just lousy with Orenberg shawls for $9.95 plus postage, but there are several problems. First the size is too small at 48 inches square. Secondly they are made by a factory process which winds the soft wool around a cotton thread core, so not authentically made 100% wool. I imagine the designs of today are not those of yester-century, either, but I have only seen that one period one in the museum picture. It was quite simple with a scalloped border, if I remember aright. There are more authentic Orenbergs available, but they cost upward of $100 or more. They would be a great spring/ summer shawl, it looks like, but they are reputedly fairly warm, too. Fuzzy. Very lacy and ephemeral looking.
Here is Anna's website. She still has the shawl article up, and several more which are good articles, so i will just link to the main page:
http://www.geocities.com/shadowofthesundial/
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Colleen Formby
Orenburg shawls are correct for the time, but they were imported from Russia, and they are made from the Orenburg goat down, which is then spun and finely knitted, so I would not think that is what this quote is referring to.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terre Schill
Colleen, you think Letitia Walton is talking about a home made shawl type, then? I realize that description "woolen" and "crocheted, netted, or something of the kind" is really all we have to go by, but the image of the Orenberg came to my mind immediately, and Letitia did say she had the option to "buy" one. Can you suggest what else it might be? I would like to get something very lightweight.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Colleen Formby
I'll also look through my collection of images, since I believe I have one of a woman wearing what it truly a "Shetland Shawl"...those are knitted with the lace weight Shetland wool, and are truly as light as a feather...that would be my guess as to what the quote was referring to as well, since they were sold commercially as well as being made at home.....there were numerous patterns out there for people to use.
I'm getting _Letters from Forest Place_ ready to send back on
interlibrary loan, and found this bit on shawls. The writer is living in Austin, corresponding with a sister in Mississippi.
Letitia Walton to Mary Watkins, Austin 24, 1861
I have seen a good many woolen shawls this year. Looked like they were crocheted, netted, or something of the kind. I think them very pretty, but did not feel ablt to buy one. I would prefer a shawl to a talma (talmas are out of fashion are they not?) and be much more obliged to you for one to wear next fall if you feel like doing that sort of work on vacation.
--_Letters from Forest Place: A Plantation Family's Correspondence, 1846-1881_. Edited by E. Grey Dimond and Herman Hattaway. Jackson: University Press of Mississippi, 1993, p. 223.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terri Shill
Vicki Betts wrote:
"Looked like they were
crocheted, netted, or something of the kind. "
Were these Orenberg shawls, do you think?
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Vicki Betts
I had to google that one. The webpages I saw said that was a Russian technique. Have you seen it in the United States in mid-19th century, maybe under another name?
I just did an advanced search on the 1860 Texas census, and was
shocked! shocked! to see 25 persons born in Russia, living in Texas in 1860. I really thought there would be zero. Nine were in Bexar County. None in Fayette, home of Henkel Square. But of course shawls could be imported. But the rest of the quote seems to indicate that her little sister back in Mississippi might make one for her, so whatever technique she is talking about she seems to think her sister would know. So I don't know. Knitting is not one of my "thangs."
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terre Schill
I will tell you the very little bit I know about Orenberg shawls, Vicki.
I first saw them listed on Anna Worden's shawl site. I don't have the web address anymore but a search should turn it up unless she has taken it down. Orenbergs are listed with about a dozen other shawl types she has documented to mid-19th century America. I did see one on a museum site once, off-white, I think Anna gave me the link to that. The period bragging on these shawls was that they could be passed through a wedding ring! So perhaps not many survived. I don't really know what they might have been called during the period. I believe they were all imported, strictly one-off, not a manufactured item.
eBay is just lousy with Orenberg shawls for $9.95 plus postage, but there are several problems. First the size is too small at 48 inches square. Secondly they are made by a factory process which winds the soft wool around a cotton thread core, so not authentically made 100% wool. I imagine the designs of today are not those of yester-century, either, but I have only seen that one period one in the museum picture. It was quite simple with a scalloped border, if I remember aright. There are more authentic Orenbergs available, but they cost upward of $100 or more. They would be a great spring/ summer shawl, it looks like, but they are reputedly fairly warm, too. Fuzzy. Very lacy and ephemeral looking.
Here is Anna's website. She still has the shawl article up, and several more which are good articles, so i will just link to the main page:
http://www.geocities.com/shadowofthesundial/
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Colleen Formby
Orenburg shawls are correct for the time, but they were imported from Russia, and they are made from the Orenburg goat down, which is then spun and finely knitted, so I would not think that is what this quote is referring to.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Terre Schill
Colleen, you think Letitia Walton is talking about a home made shawl type, then? I realize that description "woolen" and "crocheted, netted, or something of the kind" is really all we have to go by, but the image of the Orenberg came to my mind immediately, and Letitia did say she had the option to "buy" one. Can you suggest what else it might be? I would like to get something very lightweight.
Copied from Texas Civilian Yahoo! list. Posted August 2007 by Colleen Formby
I'll also look through my collection of images, since I believe I have one of a woman wearing what it truly a "Shetland Shawl"...those are knitted with the lace weight Shetland wool, and are truly as light as a feather...that would be my guess as to what the quote was referring to as well, since they were sold commercially as well as being made at home.....there were numerous patterns out there for people to use.
